I don't believe children can give informed consent to any gender transition treatment. Children cannot possibly understand the risks to future sexual function or any other side effects. Parents, too, cannot give informed consent. There are just too many irresponsible parents out there.
>The Komodo analysis of insurance claims found 56 genital surgeries among patients ages 13 to 17 with a prior gender dysphoria diagnosis from 2019 to 2021.
>Among teens, “top surgery” to remove breasts is more common. In the three years ending in 2021, at least 776 mastectomies were performed in the United States on patients ages 13 to 17 with a gender dysphoria diagnosis, according to Komodo’s data analysis of insurance claims. This tally does not include procedures that were paid for out of pocket.
>At least 14,726 minors started hormone treatment with a prior gender dysphoria diagnosis from 2017 through 2021, according to the Komodo analysis.
13 to 17 are minors and adolescents. Do you go around calling 16 year olds "children"?
That study ended in 2021. That's 5 years ago, things have changed. I don't support elective surgery for minors, including circumcision -- it's literally mutilation, but somehow the anti-trans have no problem with it. Do you support circumcision?
You are either uninformed or lying, if you are uninformed, read MarkSs post and the links for some facts. If you are lying, you are doing so at the cost of niave and vulnerable children to further your ideology. No better than the Epstien situation.
I often see people online take the word "child" and claim that puberty blockers and hormones are being prescribed to 10-year-olds. They could just say "minor". They're deliberately being dishonest.
"children can legally drive cars", this is literally true in the legal sense but that's not what it means to any educated adult.
when homophobic parents socially transition their child they set them on a collision course toward a predictable crisis when puberty hits. this can start eariler than 10. blue state schools tell kids starting in kindergarten that social transition is OK. the problem is theres no evidence gender meds or gender ID help anyone. and we know it causes severe harm. so really this is a form of child abuse. most kids who are socially transitioned go to gender meds. first they take puberty blockers. then 98% who take puberty blockers for dysphoria go to gender hormones. this common intervention is the usual path. it results in permanent chemical castration.
people who giggle and say people are being dishonest when its pointed out kids are being severely harmed are either lying or just dont know how it all works.
this article explains what gender biz means when they claim gender meds benefit kids. they are placing a large weight on a temporary salve to the crisis that occurs when socially transitioned kids experience natural puberty. another way to frame this is gender meds protect groomers from being outed as liars when puberty occurs. socially transitioned kids were sold a lie. and theres no way to avoid this fact even with gender meds
“Gender dysphoria in young people is rising—and so is professional disagreement
How Dems should treat the issue of trans rights comes down to really only three considerations: (1) treat people respectfully regardless of how they look or act, (2) allow people to live their lives as they see fit, as long as it doesn't cause harm, and (3) until you're about 18 years old you shouldn't make decisions that permanently lock you into something you can't reverse. These are humanistic positions that transcend any religious or political views. None of the polling regrading trans rights matters beyond these simple rules. The issue of trans children in sports has at its core, nothing applicable to the actual issue of trans rights. Rather, it is a fairness issue, pure and simple. The best thing that Dems could do is to acknowledge that and separate it from trans rights, as it only pollutes those waters.
I’d just add that on the subject of transwomen in women’s sports, I’ve always felt like advocates for allowing biological males to play women’s sports were the left’s equivalent of climate change deniers: folks who denied scientific reality because it pointed in a different direction than their preferred policy outcome.
forcing a trans girl to go through an unwanted male puberty with T levels in the thousands *is* permanently locking her into a body and a future she can't reverse.
“the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that individual states can decide whether to ban transgender girls from participating in sports”
This isn’t true and you know it isn’t true. What the Supreme Court ruled was that states can decide that “trans children should play on teams that match their birth sex” (as you put it later in the article).
For me, a lifetime Democrat: if Democrats choose men and men's feelings(and here I am referring to men masquerading as women) over women and our sex based rights (to safety and dignity), then Democrats will have to be called out. They need to be questioned, criticized, and in doing so we need to stress our liberal credentials. Otherwise transactivists will call us right-wing bigots. Obviously we are not. We are fighting against misogyny and homophobia, all part of transactivists' philosophy.
Saying that “decisions should be in the hands of sports leagues and school boards and not politicians” is not tenable in blue states that have laws against discrimination on the basis of gender identity. These laws mandate that a male person (including a child) claiming a female gender identity be treated as female. There is no exemption or carve-out for sports in these laws.
Similarly, the proposed federal Equality Act has no such exemption. EVERY Democrat in Congress is a co-sponsor of the Equality Act, and hence supports males in female sports.
So far, Republicans do not seem to have figured this out and used it as a point of attack.
I left the Democratic Party about 10 years ago over this issue.
I was born and raised in East LA, attended UC Berkeley, and have since resided in the East Bay (of SF Bay). I was raised to DESPISE all Republicans, no exceptions, ever.
Humans cannot change sex and single-sex sports, locker rooms, shelters, prisons, hospital and residential wards, and bathrooms were ALL created in the first place to protect the rights of female people, aka women, from male domination and violence.
Self-ID into the opposite sex category is a ridiculous, dangerous notion and THAT is why Democrats are losing on this issue.
And it is wholly disingenuous for Democrats to say that governments should stay out of sports policy, when it was trans-identified males and the ACLU who started suing the government in order to change policy in the first place.
marci bowers was pres of wpath. hes been in gender biz a long time. probably knows more about this narrow issue than anyone on earth. he says no one who was blocked at tanner stage two ever had an orgasm. if this is counter to your experience you likely started later or maybe you should ask bowers.
yes, its very common for parents of gnc kids to transition their kid. Susie Green, head of the British child sex-change charity, Mermaids, admitted her son was too feminine and thats the reason she socially transitioned him. she and her husband didnt want a gay kid. in their minds their kid isnt gay , hes a straight girl. shes admitted to all this. she even said it on a ted talk thats no longer available. she had him castrated in thailand at age 16 or similar age. isnt jazz jennings the same thing? there are 11 or so studys that found kids grow out of dysphoria with puberty unless scammed into gender ID. they also asked if they were same sex attracted . most were. UK gender clinic travstock reported 70% of their gender clinic customers were same sex attracted. the staff joked by the time they were done there would be no gay people left.
No mention of the impact on women in your article. No concern for children brainwashed into hating thier own bodies, nothing about the detransitioners with no way back from irreversible physical and psychological damage, the trans-widows, the families who won't go to the public pool anymore, the women subject to privacy and safety violations. And all this female energy spent on fighting for reality to prevail. The majority of the population (globally) will never accept wrong- sex identification as legit. And so you try to legislate our compliance, and yeah you've been largely successful so far with the legislation bit (but can you feel that ground slipping beneath your feet?), but how will you explain to the children you coerced that most people will never accept their pretence, they will very sadly be lonely and physically unwell, alongside deep feelings of regret and betrayal for the remainder of thier lives. You can legislate and bully and lie and coerce but you can't change how people perceive you, based on biological reality. All the damaged people in the wake of your ideology should keep you awake at night, but you carry on with a sense of self-righteousness that blows the mind of those of us who remain tethered to reality. And I am FURIOUS that I have to vote for political parties that are otherwise against almost everything I hold to be good and true, because the definition of women and the safety of children is the hill I will die on. So good luck with your campaign to make this idiocy palatable, it's really really not.
Thank you so much for this. I'm deeply pained at seeing the feeling of entitlement many trans activists seem to have - that any concession of ground is "throwing us under the bus". I'm afraid of how much we're likely to lose if we refuse to engage in actual strategy.
I don't believe children can give informed consent to any gender transition treatment. Children cannot possibly understand the risks to future sexual function or any other side effects. Parents, too, cannot give informed consent. There are just too many irresponsible parents out there.
Then you'll be happy to learn that gender transition treatment isn't prescribed to children!
This is simply untrue.
>The Komodo analysis of insurance claims found 56 genital surgeries among patients ages 13 to 17 with a prior gender dysphoria diagnosis from 2019 to 2021.
>Among teens, “top surgery” to remove breasts is more common. In the three years ending in 2021, at least 776 mastectomies were performed in the United States on patients ages 13 to 17 with a gender dysphoria diagnosis, according to Komodo’s data analysis of insurance claims. This tally does not include procedures that were paid for out of pocket.
>At least 14,726 minors started hormone treatment with a prior gender dysphoria diagnosis from 2017 through 2021, according to the Komodo analysis.
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-transyouth-data/
And if it WAS true, then you should have no problem with a legal ban on something that never happens anyway.
13 to 17 are minors and adolescents. Do you go around calling 16 year olds "children"?
That study ended in 2021. That's 5 years ago, things have changed. I don't support elective surgery for minors, including circumcision -- it's literally mutilation, but somehow the anti-trans have no problem with it. Do you support circumcision?
You are either uninformed or lying, if you are uninformed, read MarkSs post and the links for some facts. If you are lying, you are doing so at the cost of niave and vulnerable children to further your ideology. No better than the Epstien situation.
You can't even spell naïve correctly. I was not a "child" at 16. I wasn't a coddled baby like the kids today. We used to be a proper country!
Do you count puberty blockers as gender transition treatment?
do you? do you count a 17 year old who can drive as a "child"?
Yes. Under 18 is legally a child in every state.
I often see people online take the word "child" and claim that puberty blockers and hormones are being prescribed to 10-year-olds. They could just say "minor". They're deliberately being dishonest.
"children can legally drive cars", this is literally true in the legal sense but that's not what it means to any educated adult.
Pick one!
when homophobic parents socially transition their child they set them on a collision course toward a predictable crisis when puberty hits. this can start eariler than 10. blue state schools tell kids starting in kindergarten that social transition is OK. the problem is theres no evidence gender meds or gender ID help anyone. and we know it causes severe harm. so really this is a form of child abuse. most kids who are socially transitioned go to gender meds. first they take puberty blockers. then 98% who take puberty blockers for dysphoria go to gender hormones. this common intervention is the usual path. it results in permanent chemical castration.
people who giggle and say people are being dishonest when its pointed out kids are being severely harmed are either lying or just dont know how it all works.
this article explains what gender biz means when they claim gender meds benefit kids. they are placing a large weight on a temporary salve to the crisis that occurs when socially transitioned kids experience natural puberty. another way to frame this is gender meds protect groomers from being outed as liars when puberty occurs. socially transitioned kids were sold a lie. and theres no way to avoid this fact even with gender meds
“Gender dysphoria in young people is rising—and so is professional disagreement
Jennifer Block
How Dems should treat the issue of trans rights comes down to really only three considerations: (1) treat people respectfully regardless of how they look or act, (2) allow people to live their lives as they see fit, as long as it doesn't cause harm, and (3) until you're about 18 years old you shouldn't make decisions that permanently lock you into something you can't reverse. These are humanistic positions that transcend any religious or political views. None of the polling regrading trans rights matters beyond these simple rules. The issue of trans children in sports has at its core, nothing applicable to the actual issue of trans rights. Rather, it is a fairness issue, pure and simple. The best thing that Dems could do is to acknowledge that and separate it from trans rights, as it only pollutes those waters.
Yes. This seems spot on to me.
I’d just add that on the subject of transwomen in women’s sports, I’ve always felt like advocates for allowing biological males to play women’s sports were the left’s equivalent of climate change deniers: folks who denied scientific reality because it pointed in a different direction than their preferred policy outcome.
forcing a trans girl to go through an unwanted male puberty with T levels in the thousands *is* permanently locking her into a body and a future she can't reverse.
I am a trans woman, used to be a trans girl.
I wrote about my experience here: https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/rt2yai8JkTPYgzoEj/why-i-transitioned-a-response
Hi Lisa, this comment violates our guidelines around respect. I'm banning you from commenting on this platform for 30 days.
May I please ask how Lisa violated your guidelines around respect The way I see it, she just stated the facts
did you read my post?
“the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that individual states can decide whether to ban transgender girls from participating in sports”
This isn’t true and you know it isn’t true. What the Supreme Court ruled was that states can decide that “trans children should play on teams that match their birth sex” (as you put it later in the article).
For me, a lifetime Democrat: if Democrats choose men and men's feelings(and here I am referring to men masquerading as women) over women and our sex based rights (to safety and dignity), then Democrats will have to be called out. They need to be questioned, criticized, and in doing so we need to stress our liberal credentials. Otherwise transactivists will call us right-wing bigots. Obviously we are not. We are fighting against misogyny and homophobia, all part of transactivists' philosophy.
Yes. “Gender identity” is a sexist, homophobic, regressive theory.
Conservatives: A woman is someone who wears dresses
Genderists: Someone who wears dresses is a woman
Feminists: Wear whatever you want, clothes are clothes
Saying that “decisions should be in the hands of sports leagues and school boards and not politicians” is not tenable in blue states that have laws against discrimination on the basis of gender identity. These laws mandate that a male person (including a child) claiming a female gender identity be treated as female. There is no exemption or carve-out for sports in these laws.
Similarly, the proposed federal Equality Act has no such exemption. EVERY Democrat in Congress is a co-sponsor of the Equality Act, and hence supports males in female sports.
So far, Republicans do not seem to have figured this out and used it as a point of attack.
I left the Democratic Party about 10 years ago over this issue.
I was born and raised in East LA, attended UC Berkeley, and have since resided in the East Bay (of SF Bay). I was raised to DESPISE all Republicans, no exceptions, ever.
Humans cannot change sex and single-sex sports, locker rooms, shelters, prisons, hospital and residential wards, and bathrooms were ALL created in the first place to protect the rights of female people, aka women, from male domination and violence.
Self-ID into the opposite sex category is a ridiculous, dangerous notion and THAT is why Democrats are losing on this issue.
And it is wholly disingenuous for Democrats to say that governments should stay out of sports policy, when it was trans-identified males and the ACLU who started suing the government in order to change policy in the first place.
marci bowers was pres of wpath. hes been in gender biz a long time. probably knows more about this narrow issue than anyone on earth. he says no one who was blocked at tanner stage two ever had an orgasm. if this is counter to your experience you likely started later or maybe you should ask bowers.
yes, its very common for parents of gnc kids to transition their kid. Susie Green, head of the British child sex-change charity, Mermaids, admitted her son was too feminine and thats the reason she socially transitioned him. she and her husband didnt want a gay kid. in their minds their kid isnt gay , hes a straight girl. shes admitted to all this. she even said it on a ted talk thats no longer available. she had him castrated in thailand at age 16 or similar age. isnt jazz jennings the same thing? there are 11 or so studys that found kids grow out of dysphoria with puberty unless scammed into gender ID. they also asked if they were same sex attracted . most were. UK gender clinic travstock reported 70% of their gender clinic customers were same sex attracted. the staff joked by the time they were done there would be no gay people left.
No mention of the impact on women in your article. No concern for children brainwashed into hating thier own bodies, nothing about the detransitioners with no way back from irreversible physical and psychological damage, the trans-widows, the families who won't go to the public pool anymore, the women subject to privacy and safety violations. And all this female energy spent on fighting for reality to prevail. The majority of the population (globally) will never accept wrong- sex identification as legit. And so you try to legislate our compliance, and yeah you've been largely successful so far with the legislation bit (but can you feel that ground slipping beneath your feet?), but how will you explain to the children you coerced that most people will never accept their pretence, they will very sadly be lonely and physically unwell, alongside deep feelings of regret and betrayal for the remainder of thier lives. You can legislate and bully and lie and coerce but you can't change how people perceive you, based on biological reality. All the damaged people in the wake of your ideology should keep you awake at night, but you carry on with a sense of self-righteousness that blows the mind of those of us who remain tethered to reality. And I am FURIOUS that I have to vote for political parties that are otherwise against almost everything I hold to be good and true, because the definition of women and the safety of children is the hill I will die on. So good luck with your campaign to make this idiocy palatable, it's really really not.
Thank you so much for this. I'm deeply pained at seeing the feeling of entitlement many trans activists seem to have - that any concession of ground is "throwing us under the bus". I'm afraid of how much we're likely to lose if we refuse to engage in actual strategy.